radphotos
Posts: 22
Location: Toronto, Canada
Registered: 1 Dec 2011
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New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 1 Dec 2011 at 23:29 GMT
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Hey everyone, I'm looking to start making virtual tours and researching what's the most user-friendly and effective way to make a decent tour. I've seen a few different lenses and cameras as well as stitching programs which seem a little complicated and unforgiving if you don't get the right angled shot.
I've heard that the image quality from these 0-360 lenses is not that good and even from the samples on their site they do seem a bit pixelated. What do you guys think? Are they really that bad? How much can you fix then PS or other editing programs??
Thanks for any advice. 
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hindenhaag
Posts: 729
Location: Netherlands
Registered: 7 Mar 2010
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radphotos
Posts: 22
Location: Toronto, Canada
Registered: 1 Dec 2011
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 2 Dec 2011 at 16:13 GMT
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Thanks for the great advice....who would have thought??? SEARCH FORUM!!! you're the most helpful guy on this site!!
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Hans Nyberg
Posts: 2791
Location: Denmark
Registered: 28 Aug 2005
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 2 Dec 2011 at 17:06 GMT
updated: 2 Dec 2011 at 17:08 GMT
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People are just sick of answering about this again and again.
Just search for
one shot lens advice.
www.panoguide.com/search/?s=one+shot+lens+advice&...§ion=36&when=6+months
170 posts
And this is just a search for the last 6 months
Or trust my advice.
Are they really that bad?
Answer : Yes
Hans
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DennisS
Posts: 1292
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 2 Dec 2011 at 17:30 GMT
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radphotos,
Photo editing software can do only so much. You must do your best to get the image out of the camera as good as possible. Just like with computers: garbage in - garbage out.
One shot systems are nothing more than taking a picture reflected off of chrome plated plastic or some sort of mirror. They are not true lenses as light is reflected, not passed through. For Real Estate agents who what a very quick and dirty pano without paying for it, this system works out great. For the rest of the world that actually cares about quality, we stay away from any one shot system.
There are so many different ways to produce a panorama. Even after doing this for years, each panorama I do is individual and sometimes needs some unique processing. Not always, but sometimes.
Search every forum you can and you will see that there is no one single fast and easy way to do a quality panorama. You can take steps to minimize the time required. Do your homework. Come back and ask specific questions and post examples if you can. The harsh reality is that you will need to do "trial and error" until you find a workflow that works for you.
Dennis
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badders
Posts: 384
Location: East Kilbride, United Kingdom
Registered: 5 Dec 2007
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 3 Dec 2011 at 13:17 GMT
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radphotos said: Thanks for the great advice....who would have thought??? SEARCH FORUM!!! you're the most helpful guy on this site!!
Hans actually is one of the most helpful guys on this site... Your response sounds quite sarcastic as if you are saying, "I don't want to have to search for an answer - I want someone to give it to me..." I hope that isn't the case and you are genuinely thankful for all assistance and advice given.
One of the most effective ways to get advice on a forum is to first search for answers, because in many cases, the information you are looking for is quite often already available and so rather than having to wait for someone to directly answer you, the information is there waiting for you to use the forum search tools to find it. That's why forums have search buttons...
The replies from both Hans and Dennis also contain accurate and very good advice.
Andrew Baddeley
www.360tacticalvr.com
stores.ebay.co.uk/360tacticalvr
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DennisS
Posts: 1292
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 3 Dec 2011 at 19:06 GMT
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One more thought.
While doing research and sifting through all the various posts, questions you do not know to ask get answered. You will resolve issues before they become issues.
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radphotos
Posts: 22
Location: Toronto, Canada
Registered: 1 Dec 2011
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 5 Dec 2011 at 15:49 GMT
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No disrespect or sarcasm is meant but before I even signed up to this forum I read many posts about pano photos and got mixed results. I was merely asking that if you guys who have been through all this already could direct me as to what you would start off with knowing what you know about all this technology already. I don't have infinite amount of money where I can purchase these things and toss them to the side if I am unhappy with them. Any advise or direction would be very helpful.
Thanks
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DennisS
Posts: 1292
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 5 Dec 2011 at 16:38 GMT
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radphotos,
Since you do not have specific questions, you will get general answers. As I have stated before, there is no one single way to do a panorama.
Let's start with your current equipment. What camera/lenses do you already own? Are you PC or MAC? Do you shoot RAW or jpg? Are you a pro or newbie photographer? What is your budget if you were to go out and purchase everything (including all camera hardware/computer software)?
It would also help if you updated your user profile to include where you are located.
Dennis
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radphotos
Posts: 22
Location: Toronto, Canada
Registered: 1 Dec 2011
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 5 Dec 2011 at 17:11 GMT
updated: 5 Dec 2011 at 17:20 GMT
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I totally understand there is many ways and that is why I am trying to get as much info as possible. I am more an amateur and any advice really does help.
Here is what I'm trying to do - I do real estate photography for agents selling homes...I'm using a Nikon D90 with a AF-S DX NIKKOR 10-24mm f/3.5-4.5G ED wide-angle lens.
I guess here is my real question. Is it possible to use this lens stitch photos properly? I found the way the lens changed the angles of the walls might make it hard to stitch together even with a 30% overlap. Is there a way to use this setup and if not I'm trying to find the best way create a virtual tour where I don't waste too much time setting up the shots and then stiching them together. I know there is no easy way when you start out and are learning but I am looking for a way that gives me decent quality (agents need something quick and cheap - despite losing on the quality factor) and as least time consuming as possible.
I've looked into the 0-360 cams, the girocam and giroptic,
and I've looked into the Nikkor 10.5mm f/2.8G ED DX Fisheye with a stitching program but some of these stitching programs look extremely complicated to create very interactive tours...I need something interactive but to a certain point...if you know what I mean?
Radek
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Clay
Posts: 251
Location: Port Colborne, Ontario, Canada
Registered: 23 Aug 2004
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 5 Dec 2011 at 17:15 GMT
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"Good, Cheap, Easy"... pick two.
Quality panoramas require a significant investment in equipment, software and time to produce. For this you will need something like ....
10-12mp DSLR or Micro 4/3 camera
Full-frame fisheye lens..Samyang8mm
Panoramic head...Nodal Ninja
Sturdy Tripod...Manfrotto
Tripod level
Stitching software...PTGui
Pano publishing software... Pano2VR
Image editing software...Photoshop
$1900 perhaps?
This is my recommendation only, others may suggest equally suitable combinations.
There are two thing to realize with multiple shot solutions...
Your camera must rotate around the NPP to avoid parallax problems.
People, trees, clouds, leaves move and there will almost always be post processing.
One shot solutions whether they are multiple lenses or parabolic reflectors are a compromise. Either there will be stitching errors or low resolution and limited FOV. I doubt anyone on this forum is likely to recommend them.
However, if you think one-shot solutions are suitable for what you will be producing, and you want to compete in the low-end market, then by all means invest in that instead.
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radphotos
Posts: 22
Location: Toronto, Canada
Registered: 1 Dec 2011
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 5 Dec 2011 at 17:28 GMT
updated: 5 Dec 2011 at 17:29 GMT
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how about GOOD and CHEAP - I'm one for quality but agents need something sometimes sameday and interactive enough that it gives the feeling of being there. regardless of the fact you can't zoom in or it pixelates.
I have a tripod and photoshop and the equipment i listed above as well.
I like the idea of the one-shot system but the quality of the image is what worries me. the best I have seen so far is the girocam - www.girocam.com - but quite pricey.
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Doug Aurand
Posts: 3282
Location: Albuquerque, NM, United States
Registered: 2 Jan 2008
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 5 Dec 2011 at 17:58 GMT
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radphotos
I shoot a hundred still shoots of homes a year with half of them getting 4 scene virtual tours
Take a look at the Sunex 5.6mm or the Sigma 4.5mm
Doug Aurand
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radphotos
Posts: 22
Location: Toronto, Canada
Registered: 1 Dec 2011
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 5 Dec 2011 at 18:06 GMT
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Thanks Doug, those lenses look awesome.
What software do you use to create the tours if you don't mind me asking.
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Tactus 360
Posts: 1245
Location: Tynset, Norway
Registered: 2 Sep 2010
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Re: New to 360 degree photography
Posted: 5 Dec 2011 at 18:08 GMT
updated: 5 Dec 2011 at 18:16 GMT
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Well, as Clay said, doing panoramas properly takes a big investment. And I hope you will believe it when I say that, given your posts thus far, I think you will be dissatisfied with the one-shot result. So much so that within weeks you will be looking to upgrade. A one-shot lens would be a false economy.
One thing worries me. No one has mentioned how difficult it is to get good results, especially when considering your intentions, and the workflow can be, for a beginner, long and arduous. This will be a steep learning curve and the ultimate price you will pay is in the hours you spend in getting the results. With a good head, lens and software, your workflow will be reduced considerably, therefore providing more time for post processing.
Clay is a seasoned pro; his equipment list is possibly the best advice anyone could give you.
Jon
PS Although I do not always agree with Doug, he certainly knows how to produce reasonablish photos cheaply. But if cost is important, Clay's recommendation of a Samyang 8mm and the other equipment will set you back condiderably less than a Costal Optics 4.5mm lens. (I don't know anything of the Sigma.)
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