stalwart
Posts: 283
Location: Barton under Needwood, Staffordshire, United Kingdom
Registered: 20 Dec 2007
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WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 20 Oct 2011 at 13:01 GMT
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hi all,
If you, or a company you know, supplies 360 aerials from c.400 ft using RC helis, blimps, kites, etc, please PM me. I have an exciting commission in the UK I need to quote for this service...
thanks
Stu
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Tourdesign
Posts: 52
Location: United Kingdom
Registered: 24 Aug 2011
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 20 Oct 2011 at 13:28 GMT
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I was under the impression you already had a supplier, there are several great examples on your site.
I must admit to coming into the aerial stuff a little late, I just don't get the enquiries for it. Would also be interested though in UK suppliers, would be fun to have one on the portfolio.
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stalwart
Posts: 283
Location: Barton under Needwood, Staffordshire, United Kingdom
Registered: 20 Dec 2007
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 20 Oct 2011 at 14:48 GMT
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hi,
I have one supplier - just trying to get best value for money for the client.
Even with my client base, and offering the service for the past 2 years, I don't get that much call for it, so don't see the point in investing time and a lot of money into a 'boys toy' - considering I used to fly radio-controlled helis for years as a teenager, and being quite good at 3D flying, even I don't want to get involved directly in aerial work.
There are a few of my competitors currently building, buying UAV's etc and they're not cheap bits of kit to run, maintain or insure. As well as Civil Aviation Authority Certification as well, not worth the effort. I just think it's a bit of a passing fad with limited commercial use and minimal return on investment.
You can have one done for your portfolio - it'll just cost you!
cheers
Stuart
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Tourdesign
Posts: 52
Location: United Kingdom
Registered: 24 Aug 2011
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 20 Oct 2011 at 15:26 GMT
updated: 20 Oct 2011 at 15:27 GMT
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Completely agree, in my opinion it's the same with Giga Pixel work / gigapans, very limited commercial value although the right project can produce some good PR.
Right, i'll stop hi-jacking your thread now!
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No One
Posts: 501
Location: Sri Lanka
Registered: 14 May 2004
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 22 Oct 2011 at 3:36 GMT
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Hey Stuart,
Whats up?
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No One
Posts: 501
Location: Sri Lanka
Registered: 14 May 2004
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 22 Oct 2011 at 3:55 GMT
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Commercial value 
All relative to value to client. Never sell yourself short on value to client, aerials, giga and extreme post both in image and interactive can add lots of value and dollars to you.
Never sell yourself short, add value and up sell.
Robert
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David Tan
Posts: 155
Location: Kualalumpur, Malaysia
Registered: 31 Mar 2010
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 22 Oct 2011 at 9:14 GMT
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Robert Harshman said: Never sell yourself short, add value and up sell.
I don't really understand what you mean by selling short. But maybe you can give some advice:
In my area, there are some VR photographers that charge around US$100 per spot and normally they get a minumum of 5 spots per order. These pros can get 6 to 10 orders per year from NON-Real Estate businesses. After I did my survey on some businesses who might be interested in VR, I found out that most of them think the US$100/spot is way too high. Surprisingly, they are very serious if I can offer them US$25/spot on a minimum of 10 spots.
Summary for doing professional VR on a full time basis:
There are very few businesses who are willing to spend US$100/spot here and this can very easily lead to zero income in a month from VR.
BUT..., I believe with $25/spot, there are quite many businesses that want VR. Maybe they are just cheap and how can we beat cheap customers?
Bottom line, if I stand my ground on $100/spot even with all the extras included, I may get nothing in a month. Marketing costs money and with zero cash flow, it will really hurt.
If I sell cheap for $25/spot, I can always make money every month (much better than nothing). Is this considered selling myself short? Demand is so little and most of them are so cheap.
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Tactus 360
Posts: 1245
Location: Tynset, Norway
Registered: 2 Sep 2010
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 22 Oct 2011 at 10:03 GMT
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Hmm,
It is the old "Better 10 customers paying $50 than 1 paying 450" adage that my father liked to instill on his trainee salesmen, and whether we like it or not, until our individual names are associated with a product, this approach is best. I think this is what a previous contributor to this forum was doing in offering very cheap tours, knowing that if it was inexpensive enough, then reshoots were always on the horizons. And people talk, so when one has a reputation for competence and inexpensiveness, then one is always going to do well.
This is a rather strange attitude from all these "never mind the quality, feel the width" cowboys that you mention, David (I assume they are just that), and they never realise unless they produce things at a professional rate and with professional qualities, then their "profession" is going to be not only a fringe one of which few will take notice, but it will also be a very short one.
This is always a problem, not least when you compare the average salaries/fees around the world, the Cost of Living Index and generally uninformed clients, who see no difference between someone taking full HDR imagery, providing a luxury GUI and making sure that everything is perfect, with one who has a 1-shot lens and who thinks HDR means High Dropout Rate (for those of his/her calibre, it must be an important factor to consider).
The answer is never simple. We are a commodity and that is only valuable as long as there is no competition and no one around tells potential clients that they can do the same job cheaper.
This is a lack of understanding of the work that is involved in taking and producing even a simple virtual tour (after all, everyone has a camera, so taking a virtual tour can't be that difficult). It will never be solved unless you are prepared to be "unprofessional" about things and really inform your customers of not only the benefits of using YOUR services, but also how much superior yours are to others.
None of us likes doing that; however, with the world economy (blah, blah, blah).
Jon
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Tourdesign
Posts: 52
Location: United Kingdom
Registered: 24 Aug 2011
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 22 Oct 2011 at 15:59 GMT
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Robert Harshman said: Commercial value
All relative to value to client. Never sell yourself short on value to client, aerials, giga and extreme post both in image and interactive can add lots of value and dollars to you.
Never sell yourself short, add value and up sell.
Robert
Maybe it's me, but i'm not really getting what you're trying to say.
For me it's a simple business decision, i'm not going to spend time and money on a system that I don't feel will bring enough commercial value. If it's not going to pay its way, it's not worth it. I'm sure the one or two clients a year that may want an aerial pano will love it, but i'm not going to lose money just to make those one or two clients happy. If I took that attitude, i'd be out of business in no time.
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No One
Posts: 501
Location: Sri Lanka
Registered: 14 May 2004
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Re: WANTED : 400 ft aerial 360 service
Posted: 22 Oct 2011 at 23:53 GMT
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All I'm saying is don't discount technologies or options just because your client base can't see the value in them. You need to sell them on value if you want to do that.
And of course it would be commercial folly for a photographer to buy extra equipment that you can't make a return on from 1-3 shoots.
Aerial RC work is probably a crazy idea for 99.99% of all photographers. It's extremely expensive to build great platforms, maintain them, keep your flying skills current and the liability insurance for commercial work is insanely expensive.
It should be. Flying things tend to fall from the sky at some point. No one wants to be on the news hour and dealing with insurance claims or lawsuits. At best you lose a craft, camera, lens. At worst...don't even want to go there.
But much safer and closer to ground is giga pixel, 360 video, extremely extended interfaces or value added interactions. 360 work can be so much more than just a simple 360 view. At this point if that's all you do, even if done very well, you should probably be looking for a new gig.
Simple 360's are yesterday's technology, still nice, but hardly a commercial viable living.
Cheers,
Robert
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