John Willetts
Posts: 227
Location: Bath, United Kingdom
Registered: 13 Mar 2008
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Sale of Copyright
Posted: 18 Nov 2009 at 10:53 GMT
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I have a panorama of a Stately Home which is now a rather exclusive school. The picture was taken for my own collection with permission.
The school has approached me wanting to buy all rights to the panorama and the associated Little Planet version.
Has anyone had any experience of this sort of thing - and how much should I charge?
Thanks
John
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Jon Baxendale
Posts: 767
Location:
Registered: 4 Jun 2007
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Re: Sale of Copyright
Posted: 18 Nov 2009 at 12:12 GMT
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Difficult question, John. Most schools seem to think that this sort of thing should be given to them, at least in the state sector. However, I think that with private schools, it will be different.
How are they going to use the panoramas? Are they going to be used just on the web, or will they be a part of a presentation CD, used in a brochure, etc. I think you need to establish that first and then start discussing money, since the more ways they want to use the panorama should govern what you should pay . . . At least in my view.
The thing that you need to remember, though, is that however a school is going to use the pano is ultimately going to generate income for them, since the image will be a good selling point for the school and will aid in fee-paying kids enrolling!
Don't sell yourself short!
Jon
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John Willetts
Posts: 227
Location: Bath, United Kingdom
Registered: 13 Mar 2008
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Re: Sale of Copyright
Posted: 18 Nov 2009 at 12:33 GMT
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Thanks for the reply, Jon.
It's a large, and apparently, successful private school. They want to use the work for web and print - including selling the Little Planets to parents as Greetings Cards so it's a difficult dilema. How long is a piece of string?
John
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Jon Baxendale
Posts: 767
Location:
Registered: 4 Jun 2007
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Re: Sale of Copyright
Posted: 18 Nov 2009 at 12:36 GMT
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Then I would ask for a good sum. It is useless me or any of my Scandinavian colleagues to suggest a price, since pay is so much higher in these countries. However, perhaps a British colleague would answer . . .
Watch this space.
Jon
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Doug Aurand
Posts: 2590
Location: Albuquerque, NM, United States
Registered: 2 Jan 2008
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Re: Sale of Copyright
Posted: 18 Nov 2009 at 16:44 GMT
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John
Please keep us posted on how you do with this sale.
I've been shooting some scenes around New Mexico for panoramic posters and may sell rights to some of them and would be interested.
I've realized we virtual tour photographers can produce photos that other well paid photogs can't because they don't know about "stitching" images together.
Those that do will try using the Photomerge tool in Photoshop which can't come close to what PTGui can do.
Good luck
Doug Aurand
Albuquerque, NM
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Robert Harshman
Posts: 347
Location: Austin, TX and Chicago, IL, United States
Registered: 14 May 2004
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Re: Sale of Copyright
Posted: 18 Nov 2009 at 18:03 GMT
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In this case, I think perhaps the most important question in pricing may be how hard would it be for them to recreate this image(s)? If you have something that is impossible for them to recreate the value just went up many times. If it's fairly easy for them to recreate then you need to keep your pricing a bit more in line with prevailing rates for the probably use and target.
From what you're describing, it sounds like a local market use with a variety of print and web use over a 5+ year span, perhaps much longer. If the school has 100 students then price x, if the school has 1,000 students then price 10x?
There are many many factors that come into play when pricing work. If you can find their budget for this, perhaps that would be the best guide and way forward. If their budget is low perhaps you can find a way to move forward without transferring the copyright.
As you know selling the copyright is a very big deal and would typically increase a price by at least 2-3 times if not much more. So, if they came to you and said we want to use this image(s) for x for n numbers of year, what would you charge? Figure that out, and then multiply it by at least 2 times, if not 3 or more.
Good Luck and it's a nice problem to have 
Robert
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Doug Aurand
Posts: 2590
Location: Albuquerque, NM, United States
Registered: 2 Jan 2008
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Re: Sale of Copyright
Posted: 18 Nov 2009 at 18:14 GMT
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Robert made a really good point that occured to me after I made my post;
How much would it cost to hire another photog to take the same shot or how much would you charge if they hired you to shoot it in the first place.
A frew months ago I got a job shooting new stills for the High Fiance Restaurant on top of Sandia Peak just outside Albuquerque. Because the restaurant site on the edge of a cliff, its hard to get good shots of it. I shot a panorama of 5 shots and they loved it.
I just didn't charge enough for the shoot, but I chalked it up to a learning experience and have a better idea what to charge next time.
Be honest with and tell them you're not sure how much to charge. Bring up the questions of copyright vs license-to-use and see if they'll make an offer to get things started
Good luck
Doug Aurand
Albuquerque, NM
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John Willetts
Posts: 227
Location: Bath, United Kingdom
Registered: 13 Mar 2008
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Re: Sale of Copyright
Posted: 18 Nov 2009 at 19:17 GMT
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Over the past months, I've learned that the real money is to be made out of 'original Little Planet' Greetings Cards and prints which is growing into a very nice little earner. The cards cost me 50p to produce and I wholesale them for 1.50 pounds. They are sold on for between 2.50 and 3 pounds. If it a 'requested' pan I charge a nominal amount - between 50 & 100 pounds depending on the client.
In this case, I approached the school. As they have 500 wealthy students/parents, I estimated my profit from the cards to be at least 1000 pounds.
Now, do I ask 1000 and risk losing everything - in fact, it wouldn't be a loss because I could put it in the common collection - just a slower earner.
John
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