Erik Ahrend
Posts: 88
Location: Canary Islands, Spain
Registered: 26 May 2005
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Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 12:42 GMT
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Hi. If you were faced with choosing just ONE file format to display your panos in a website, would you go for Java or Flash (no other options this time I´m afraid..).
Once you decided the format, which viewer would you choose? (the most versatile, easy to use and stable in your opinion).
Thanks!!
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Henri Smeets
Posts: 170
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
Registered: 28 Nov 2006
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 12:48 GMT
updated: 23 Jun 2008 at 12:49 GMT
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My choice is Flash, most of my clients have it installed.
I used Java before due to the fact that I really liked the ImmerVsion Java quality but after many complaints and requests for Flash I switched to Pano2VR. (Immervisions Flash was not flexible enough for me)
Pano2VR let's me create easily customised controllers and logo for each client.
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Erik Ahrend
Posts: 88
Location: Canary Islands, Spain
Registered: 26 May 2005
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 13:43 GMT
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Hi and thanks for your reply. I am currently using immervision because of the great ease of use and the flexibility and "customability" of the Java player. Splasher and the hotspot creator are a plus for me, but the Flash viewer is, as you point, very limited.
I´ll have a look into Pano2VR, other opinions will be most appreciated.
Best, Erik.
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Erik Ahrend
Posts: 88
Location: Canary Islands, Spain
Registered: 26 May 2005
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 13:44 GMT
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By the way, how are the hotspots implemented in Pano2VR?
Thanks!!
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Doug Aurand
Posts: 1793
Location: Albuquerque, NM, United States
Registered: 2 Jan 2008
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 14:29 GMT
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Erik
It sounds like you're pretty good with the ImmerVision software, how are you at Flash?
Since neither Java or Flash are going disappear anytime soon, what would be the benefit of changing completely from one to the other?
I'd start learning how to create Flash powered panoramas so you can offer the technology to those who want it, but keep the Java/ImmerVision work as your core technology for the near future.
Doug Aurand
Albuquerque, NM
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Erik Ahrend
Posts: 88
Location: Canary Islands, Spain
Registered: 26 May 2005
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 15:29 GMT
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Doug, fortunately I am doing very well with the Immervision software, but mainly with Java. It allows me to customize a good number of things (loading screen, easy integration of hotspots, different user interfaces, etc). The problem is that the Flash viewer isn´t so versatile and has serious limitations, and even when the quality is good you can simply display the panorama and that´s basically it (unless I have skipped something..)..I have to say that I am very happy with the Java player and the quality of the pano display.
I am currently finishing my new website, which has quite a bit of Flash content. I allready warn the viewers to download it if required, so I thought that if the panos could be in the same format that would make things easier and allow for just ONE plugin download..For the described reasons (and a few more) I am not going to use Immervision´s Flash player, so if I decide to go for "Flash only" than I am going to need n alternative that allows full customization and easy hotspot integration..
Best, Erik.
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mediavets
Posts: 1179
Location: Isleham, Cambs., United Kingdom
Registered: 8 Feb 2008
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 15:49 GMT
updated: 23 Jun 2008 at 15:55 GMT
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If I was to choose just one technology to display panos it would be Flash; because Flash is almost ubiquitous on personal computers these days.
The new KRPano flash panorama player is very customisable if one is good at coding XML:
www.krpano.com/
I use Autopano Pro for stitching and Version 2 of APP will integrate KRPano:
"KRPano collaboration. We signed an collaboration with Klaus Reinfeld to integrate a direct KRPano export in autopano. You can edit hotspots, lens flar, directly in the editor. But we will also collaborate a lot to make the best flash panorama viewer of KRPano. For VR, for small size landscape as well as gigapixels panorama ( with HDView projection technics )."
You can read more about what's going to be in APP V2 here:
www.autopano.net/forum/t3966-autopano-2.0-road-map
Andrew
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mskp
Posts: 239
Location:
Registered: 19 Oct 2006
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Doug Aurand
Posts: 1793
Location: Albuquerque, NM, United States
Registered: 2 Jan 2008
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 15:56 GMT
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So the only benefit of Flash would be; if the vistor to your site doesn't have the needed version, they would only have to upgrade Flash.
It unlikely they will be able to navigate the 'Net without a Flash and Java install in place.
Since some version of both Flash and Java have near 100% market penetration, why not develope the site to be compatable with an older version to make it easier on your visitors and use both.
The same applies to Java
Doug Aurand
Albuquerque, NM
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Ken Warner
Posts: 643
Location: Mammoth Lakes, United States
Registered: 14 Aug 2004
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 16:45 GMT
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I'm glad to see that Java is still being considered for mass deployment.
A year ago, Panoguidians were sounding the imminent death of Java and long live Flash.
PTViewer and Immervision's viewers are good viewers. Flash is getting much better. I think the competition between the two is healthy and productive for everyone.
Quicktime seems to have reduced in popularity but it's still a really good viewer.
And DevalVR is excellent.
If Microsoft decides to start shipping Windows with Java installed that will tilt the balance toward Java.
I think all of you that have pano websites are just going to have to stay light on your feet for a while. IMHO there doesn't really seem to be a clear choice yet.
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mediavets
Posts: 1179
Location: Isleham, Cambs., United Kingdom
Registered: 8 Feb 2008
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Doug Aurand
Posts: 1793
Location: Albuquerque, NM, United States
Registered: 2 Jan 2008
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 17:09 GMT
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Ken & Andrew
Although Microsoft is no longer including their version of Java (MS JVM) with Windows, most of the computer manufacturers have stepped in and are pre-installing it.
I took a look a the Control Panel of a dozen computers on display at a CompUSA one time and they all had Java Coffer Cups. And the refurbished Compaq I bought last year already had Java installed too.
The manufacturers are also pre-installing Flash too, my Compaq did
So the market penetration of both Java & Flash is near 100% and will likely remain so
Doug Aurand
Albuquerque, NM
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Henri Smeets
Posts: 170
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands
Registered: 28 Nov 2006
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 19:28 GMT
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Java is far from the 100% mark I'm afraid, on Windows it reached 62% december 2007 (80% on Mac) and MS is still not including it so we still have a problem when publishing Java.
This is what I experienced with my clients. If I deliver a Java based panorama some can't even view it, even big corporations no less! That's why I made the move to Flash only, version 9 reaching near 98% penetration and easy implementation and regular trusted upgrades.
I read somewhere that in the near future PDF will support Flash as well, interactive panoramas in PDF documents, that's nice! 
All depends off course on the exact target audience, professional vs personal and on the choice of the author, it's a free world/net.
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Hans Nyberg
Posts: 1774
Location: Denmark
Registered: 28 Aug 2005
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 20:01 GMT
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Henri
Interactive panoramas as QTVR has been supported in PDF for the last 4 years.
Here are links to Graphic Exchange from 2004
First edition is featuring Jook Leung
www.gxo.com/download.php
The second is featuring me and my Royal Wedding panorama. Page 30
www.gxo.com/download1.php
You need the full versions for included movies.
For Mac users you should note that Preview does not support interactive PDF. You need to open it in Acrobat Reader.
It is not very difficult creating a PDF with Quicktime movies.
Hans
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Doug Aurand
Posts: 1793
Location: Albuquerque, NM, United States
Registered: 2 Jan 2008
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Re: Just ONE format (Java or Flash)..?
Posted: 23 Jun 2008 at 20:19 GMT
updated: 23 Jun 2008 at 20:27 GMT
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Henri
Adobe has long reported Java's market penetration at 84%+/- in their Flash Player Penetration survey.
www.adobe.com/products/player_census/flashplayer/
Since they're also showing only 82.2% penetration for the Windows Media Player, which is included in all versions of Windows (except for the never used version created to satisfy the EC's Anti-Trust lawsuit), that would mean to me that virtually all PCs have Java.
Doug Aurand
Albuquerque, NM
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