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Thread: New Android smart phones and Flash

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Tim Eastman

Posts: 209
Location:
Registered: 15 Nov 2006
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 15:31 GMT
I don't have a smart phone or an I pad. I can see wanting to have panos on an I pad to be easily shown, but is it really worth going to all the trouble of creating a beautifully stitched panorama if it the output is a postage stamp? It would seem the input could be pretty sloppy and nobody would be able to pick up stitching errors. From what I see we have become obsessed by smart phones or whatever they are called. It is bad enough having a computer and the obsessive email and web checking behavior. At least when we are not close to our computers we can get a break, but one of life's constants now is people disengaged from the world, instead glued to their device, unable to resit the temptation. I guess my reluctance to embrace this technology stems from my fear of checking out like the rest of the world!
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jimmyd

Posts: 184
Location: United States
Registered: 6 Nov 2004
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 15:49 GMT
updated: 2 Feb 2013 at 15:51 GMT
Hey Dennis,

Just to give you more data...Go to the app store and download 'Boat'. It is a rather modern browser that I have found rather responsive. Actually, it is my browser of choice when I side load Flash to stream video from my tablet to the TV. I know ultimately you are going to want a solution for the stock browser (I think it may be a different version of Chrome?) but it could help in your analysis to see if there is a tangible difference. That might allow you to extrapolate the issue.

I am loving the contribution and the overall opinions of everyone on this topic. All of us that have interactive 360's a deliverable commercially can benefit from a little more perspective and knowledge on this subject. I'm looking forward to reading on.

James
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DennisS

Posts: 1759
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 16:07 GMT
Tim,

My objective is to have something not attached to the internet that I can quickly display an example of what a spherical panorama is without booting up my laptop. I have been doing this for years on my iPod. If I could do it "in camera" I would. The S3 has such a beautifully large and colorful screen. I have decided that it is worth the effort even if in the end I may not be able to make it work.

Have you seen a panorama on an iPad? Hardly postage stamp size. They look great. Lots of detail and yes, you can spot stitching errors. It will be a long way off when we will be able to distribute a full blown tour with all the bells and whistles on a mobile device. That day will come. Background sound does not work on my iPod but DOES on my S3.

When I am out in the field shooting and someone asks what I am doing, having my iPod in my pocket pre loaded with a couple dozen panoramas goes a long way to explaining what I am doing rather than spending 5 minutes explaining. The Gyro effect is absolutely stunning. If people are interested I direct them to my web site.

Don't be afraid of technology. When properly used it enhances your life. If you let it take over your life, well then it is your own fault.

This is my first smart phone. My identiy is not wrapped up in my toys.

(Don’t' go into the light!!!)

Dennis
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DennisS

Posts: 1759
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 16:11 GMT

jimmyd said:

...Go to the app store and download 'Boat'.
Been there, done that. I have tried just about each and every app that resembles a browser. I either get "Flash, HTML5 or CSS3 must be enabled on this device" or something like that, the pano crashes the phone, it way too slow or the network error I previously posted. Opera has come the closest but is just way too gosh darn slow.

I did not think downloading a browser would put addtional bloatware on my phone. I think the browser was "I browser". Just by launching it I got a few extra apps downloaded and installed that I did not want.

Thanks for the info. Maybe Boat will work on other devices.
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Tim Eastman

Posts: 209
Location:
Registered: 15 Nov 2006
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 17:59 GMT
I know the Ipad display is beautiful and makes a great display; no argument there. Maybe it is just the masses always checking their mobile devices that mystifies me. Kind of like crack, at traffic lights, driving down the road, anywhere and everywhere and the incivility they spawn. Sure they are cool and can be very handy, but the coolness needs to be balanced against the above. My favorite, seen countless times at the self check aisle at the grocery store, is someone unable to put their phone down, who consequently cannot scan their items and takes five times as long, oblivious to their rudeness and inconsideration.
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DemonDuck

Posts: 418
Location:
Registered: 10 Mar 2011
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 18:43 GMT

Judy-A said:


It’s instructive to read Steve Jobs’ reasons for rejecting Adobe Flash on Apple’s mobile devices (April 2010). If you had been in his shoes at the time, you might have made the same decision.

www.apple.com/hotnews/thoughts-on-flash/

Flash does its computing in software. Jobs wanted to do it directly in hardware.

Judy


Read the reference -- this paragraph is a red herring.


Apple has many proprietary products too. Though the operating system for the iPhone, iPod and iPad is proprietary, we strongly believe that all standards pertaining to the web should be open. Rather than use Flash, Apple has adopted HTML5, CSS and JavaScript – all open standards. Apple’s mobile devices all ship with high performance, low power implementations of these open standards. HTML5, the new web standard that has been adopted by Apple, Google and many others, lets web developers create advanced graphics, typography, animations and transitions without relying on third party browser plug-ins (like Flash). HTML5 is completely open and controlled by a standards committee, of which Apple is a member.


First of all, your entire friggin' operating system is "software". And it's propriatory as Hell is to the Devil. Try to crack Apple's OS and you'd have black helicopters landing on your roof at 4:00am.

And software is only used to program and direct hardware. You think your GPU does graphics in hardware but where does the managment of what the GPU does come from? THE SOFTWARE PROGRAM USING THE GPU!!!

Further, just because you use a plugin to run and display data-- that's basically what a Flash panorama is -- doesn't mean you can't use other open standard stuff in the same HTML page. I mean, that's exactly what we all do now. Put a reference to a Flash plugin in to an HTML page. Job's rational is just marketingspeak for consumption by the gullible as a rational for protecting a business interest. And while I'm not surprised at the gullibility of the masses, I am hopeful that new managment at Apple will suddenly reverse viewpoint and then all the fanboys will love Flash again.
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DemonDuck

Posts: 418
Location:
Registered: 10 Mar 2011
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 19:16 GMT
And further, Adobe has added GPU support to Flash. That's what Flash 11 brought. So the whole hardwarve vs. software argument is moot at best.
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DennisS

Posts: 1759
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 22:39 GMT
...is someone unable to put their phone down...
It cracks me up seeing someone with a bluetooth headset stuck in their ear all day long. Are you that important that you need to be in constant and continious communication with all the other people addicted to toys?

I totally agree that there are very rude people who think their cell phone is more important than the person standing (sitting) right in front of them. You do not have to yell into your cell phone any more. My wife and I were amazed the last time we were standing in line at Disneyland. So many people (youths mainly) who were in groups, all interacting with their cell phone rather than with each other. "Put the cell phone down and step away".

In other news...

I found a browser that actually loads Flash when opening a Flash panorama on my phone. Ninesky Browser. The pano loaded but I could not pan around or zoom or interact with the image at all. The quest continues...
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DennisS

Posts: 1759
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 2 Feb 2013 at 22:49 GMT
First of all, your entire friggin' operating system is "software".


The software contained inside your CPU, hard drive cotroller, graphics card and such is called Micro Code. The instructions are burned into the chip. This code executes very fast.

Software stored on your hard drive or in memory executes much slower. Jobs wanted the calculations done where they would be executed the quickest - hardware. Software emulation has been around for years. It is always faster to have the Micro code inside hardware do the work instead of software.
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DennisS

Posts: 1759
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 3 Feb 2013 at 0:40 GMT
I finally got Opera to work. I had to change a setting to allow local files as well as optimizing my Pano2VR project just for my phone.

Now I can display my panos locally on my phone with reasonable speed without any lockups.
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DemonDuck

Posts: 418
Location:
Registered: 10 Mar 2011
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 3 Feb 2013 at 18:35 GMT

DennisS said:

First of all, your entire friggin' operating system is "software".

The software contained inside your CPU, hard drive cotroller, graphics card and such is called Micro Code. The instructions are burned into the chip. This code executes very fast.

Software stored on your hard drive or in memory executes much slower. Jobs wanted the calculations done where they would be executed the quickest - hardware. Software emulation has been around for years. It is always faster to have the Micro code inside hardware do the work instead of software.


The OS is compiled to machine code that accesses and uses microcode to run the computer or cellphone.

Yes, microcode runs the machine. But it is not the OS.

Whatever is in the CPU, GPU, APU is accessed by the OS or other software programs. I understand the difference between microcode and "software emulation" but whatever is in microcode in in the various chips is always under the control of the OS or a program. Unless you are visualizing your iWhatever as some kind of autonomous being.

When the OS wants to write to disk, the OS accesses the disk controller microcode and the disk writes. When a program like Flash wants to put a pixel somewhere on the screen, it accesses the microcode in the graphics hardware directly or indirectly. Prior to Flash 11, the graphics hard ware wasn't accessed directly but through available software in the OS -- I think -- this is where I get a little fuzzy. I don't know exactly what the actual difference is between Flash 10 and Flash 11. But Flash 11 is said to now use the graphics hardware directly. That's why early versions of Flash 11 crashed my computer.

It's all B.S. anyway. The speed difference Jobs is talking about is just about unnoticeable.
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DennisS

Posts: 1759
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 5 Feb 2013 at 7:50 GMT
On the Garden Gnome forum someone posted the Flash 11.1 installer for Android. You have to set your security settings to allow installing software from sources other than the Play Store.

All my panoramas that look for either Flash or HTML5 now load the Flash version. If you are not a member of the Garden Gnome forum, search the internet for Adobe_install_flash_player_ics.apk.

Don't know where the guy got the file, really don't care.
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Hans Nyberg

Posts: 2873
Location: Denmark
Registered: 28 Aug 2005
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 5 Feb 2013 at 13:01 GMT
Dennis

You should read a little more the advice we give you.
I already gave you the link to ADOBE flash download for android APK on the first page of this thread.

Hans
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DennisS

Posts: 1759
Location: Los Anglels, United States
Registered: 1 Sep 2007
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 5 Feb 2013 at 16:37 GMT
And the installation instructions (or at least a hint on where to start looking) were also just as helpful.
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Hans Nyberg

Posts: 2873
Location: Denmark
Registered: 28 Aug 2005
Re: New Android smart phones and Flash
Posted: 5 Feb 2013 at 18:47 GMT
updated: 5 Feb 2013 at 18:48 GMT

DennisS said:

And the installation instructions (or at least a hint on where to start looking) were also just as helpful.


Well with the skills you tell everyone here you have I could not imagine that it was needed. In my install I only followed the popups which I got after downloading the APK and "clicking" on it.

I can now also confirm what you found about using HTML5 offline from the SD card. I also get the network error.

Hans
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