Shantic
Posts: 327
Location: Puerto Vallarta, Jalisco, Mexico, Mexico
Registered: 12 Apr 2005
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Camera Upgrade
Posted: 24 Aug 2005 at 9:59 GMT
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Ok, so I am looking for an upgrade 
My budget is not that much and I have never had a SLR, so I was wondering if the Canon 20D+Peleng 8mm would be a good choice?
or how about even a 300D ( or 350D) + Peleng 8mm ?
any coments? 
can't aford a 10.5 or another high priced lens yet 
Shanti
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Algenon
Posts: 135
Location: Australia
Registered: 29 Jun 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 24 Aug 2005 at 11:39 GMT
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Hi Shanti,
My advice is to stick with what you have until you can afford the Nikon.
Algenon
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Smooth
Posts: 3773
Location: Mount Panorama, Australia
Registered: 21 Jul 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 24 Aug 2005 at 15:28 GMT
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Go with a Canon 350D and Sigma 8mm. (best value combination)
350D is a better camera than the Nikon D70s.
Sigma 8mm fisheye is a much better lens than the Peleng.
Regards, Smooth 
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Shantic
Posts: 327
Location: Puerto Vallarta, Jalisco, Mexico, Mexico
Registered: 12 Apr 2005
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 24 Aug 2005 at 20:25 GMT
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I saw the sigma, but its almost 600 dlls for just the lens   , should I wait and definitly get this lens? does it really do MUCH diference from the peleng ?
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Andrey Ilyin
Posts: 642
Location: Moscow,
Registered: 8 Dec 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 24 Aug 2005 at 20:36 GMT
updated: 24 Aug 2005 at 20:38 GMT
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THe main problem with Peleng is sample to sample variations. Jeff's Peleng is great, very sharp and contrasty. THe sample I used to test here, in Moscow was so-so.
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Jeffrey Martin
Posts: 275
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 5 Dec 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 24 Aug 2005 at 22:23 GMT
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Yes,
Smooth--stop knocking my peleng, man! or we can fight. peleng on your head hurts worse than your plastic sigma 
Seriously -- my peleng is *really* good. After saving up and buying the sigma, i was totally disappointed. MOre vignetting, more color fringing (CA chromatic aberration -- ok fix it photoshop...) and yes, a *bit* sharper -- for an image that's 20% SMALLER than the peleng. OK, i'll admit, it has no lens flare, which is really amazing. that's the reason i use it more these days. But still, for a simplified workflow, peleng is better: no need for heavy corrections (CA, vignetting) in photoshop before stitching. (Sure the peleng does have CA but it's tolerable)
So, Shantic, my advice, buy the peleng (300d is fine) and if it sucks, sell it and lose $20 on the whole sale.
You still have your raynox
When you get your peleng, let me know, i'll give you a hand with nodal point distance, etc.
smooth,
i'll post 2 panos of the same scene, one from sigma and one from peleng, and you can try guessing which came from which lens.... if you can tell, your eyes are better than mine....
enjoy,
jeffrey
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FTrippie
Posts: 2
Location:
Registered: 24 May 2005
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 25 Aug 2005 at 0:21 GMT
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Hi Guys,
While on the subject; there has been mainly talk about choosing between Nikon D70 (with Sigma 8mm or Nikkor 10.5mm)and Canon 350D (with Sigma 8mm). And ending up with Nikon D70 only because the Nikkor is so much better.
BUT:
1. I forgot, but wasn't there a similar good Canon lens coming out soon?
2. More importantly, how about the Olympus E-300 (Evolt) with the 8mm Olympus Zuiko coming out soon (see www.dpreview.com/news/0506/05063001olympus_fishey...)?
And related:
3. Does anybody know if the Sigma 8mm works with the Olympus E-300?
4. Is the Zuiko 8mm similar to the Sigma 8mm in so far that indeed only 4 shots +TB need to be taken?
Cheers,
Flip.
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Smooth
Posts: 3773
Location: Mount Panorama, Australia
Registered: 21 Jul 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 25 Aug 2005 at 5:37 GMT
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Jeff,
Mate, I'll take you up on that challenge. (Just for sport) Both images to be shot outdoors with the sun in direct view. (No post editing!) Not that you big on that anyway! (No offence - missing arms etc.)
OK, so I was a little harsh on the Peleng (Maybe!).
But correct me if I'm wrong.
>It is a manual focus lens
>Lens flare is bad
>It weighs a ton
>Other photographers laugh at it
I don't say not to use one. Some good results can be had with one for sure. But if it was truly better then more would recommend it and even yourself would use it exclusively.
The reason I suggested the Sigma is because it is easy to use. Has a resale value and automatic focus. Well recommended by many people. The price is not all that much different either.
Look, that simple fact is that almost all combinations of DSLR and Fisheye lenses work great if you work around their little know and documented issue's.
I love the Nikkor 10.5mm Fisheye. But the D70 leaves a bit to be desired for me in general shooting. So I recommend the Fuji S3. But you could hardly call that system budget compared with the Canon 350D/Rebel XT and Sigma combo.
Not everybody wishes to produce a masterpiece - just make a nice full screen pano that can be sold, for an acceptable outlay on equipment.
Regards, Smooth
www.smooth360.com
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Smooth
Posts: 3773
Location: Mount Panorama, Australia
Registered: 21 Jul 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 25 Aug 2005 at 5:46 GMT
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$600 for the Sigma (Well, you can buy better than that!) Consider this: You will upgrade your camera body. You keep the lens!
The camera body will be out of date within months of purchase.
Regards, Smooth
www.smooth360.com
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Andrey Ilyin
Posts: 642
Location: Moscow,
Registered: 8 Dec 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 25 Aug 2005 at 7:03 GMT
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Hi Smooth,
It seems that I'm the only person here who shot with all three lenses mentioned above.
So I can comment a it while Jeff is out, enjoying with great beer
1. I shoot panos in manual focus mode, as most of panoshooters here, I guess. So Peleng's MF isn't an issue.
2. Flare is localazed near the edges (if happens at all), to get protected from flare you need to make 6+ shots for cylinder.
3. No, it doesn't weigh a ton. Not more than extra 100g compared to sigma.
4. Who cares about opinion of people who like to march in columns? The dog is barking - the caravan is moving.
I was testing Sigma as well. And it seems that sigma doesn't utilize even 6 Mp sensor potential. Being mounted on 350D it will produce bigger pano, but the amount of information will be the same as with 300D or D70. Who need 8Mb of soft image?
I belive that Shantic is on the tight budget.In his position I would get Peleng (BTW, it has good resale value too) and second-hand 300D, which is capable camera, despite what Canon's marketing department is saying to 300D owners, urging them to upgrade. The whole set can be cheaper than new Sigma.
Fuji is great camera. But it handles RAW very slowly (10 seconds per shot), what makes this camera useless for me - I like to shoot action panos in harsh light.
BR,
Andrey
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Shantic
Posts: 327
Location: Puerto Vallarta, Jalisco, Mexico, Mexico
Registered: 12 Apr 2005
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 25 Aug 2005 at 7:25 GMT
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Thanks andrey, I think i will go with the peleng, i mean i don't know where people get a sigma under 590dlls because I can't find it on the net for anything less, and 590 dlls gets me the 300d and the peleng ( ok so maybe I have to chip in a little more but not that much)
to be honest I don't care abiut manual focus since even with my stupid manual focus on my olympus, thats what I use, weight? hmm i don't think i care either, i am not going to hike with it, and my raynox is really heavy too, so this is not an isue either, I don't need panos to print I just need an ocasional full screen if my clients want it, but half the screen is good for me almost all the time, the peleng is 150 - 200 dlls correct me if I am wrong, but even my raynox is expensier and could I really get a better lens at this price?
Thanks for all the replies
Shanti Castillo G.
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daiq
Posts: 8
Location:
Registered: 19 Aug 2005
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 25 Aug 2005 at 14:22 GMT
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Does anyone use or have advice about this one?
Nikon Coolpix 8700 and FC-E9 Fisheye Converter Lens, it's just around $800 or so.
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Theo
Posts: 157
Location: Canada
Registered: 17 Jun 2005
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Jeffrey Martin
Posts: 275
Location: Prague, Czech Republic
Registered: 5 Dec 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 25 Aug 2005 at 15:48 GMT
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Smooth said:
>It is a manual focus lens
>Lens flare is bad
>It weighs a ton
>Other photographers laugh at it
I don't say not to use one. Some good results can be had with one for sure. But if it was truly better then more would recommend it and even yourself would use it exclusively.
Oh really! How many times do you focus a fisheye lens every day? 3? 4? If you don't know how to turn that focus ring, you shouldn't be holding a camera.
Lens flare is almost never a problem (that was before i started using enblend). using smartblend, it's a problem maybe 1 out of 25 shots, at the most.
It weighs hardly more than the sigma.
Do you really choose your equipment based on what other people think of how it looks? I guess you also wear the jeans that are in fashion for the year, and then throw them away next year. I'm sorry you have to live your life like that. At any rate, *no one* laughed at *my* peleng , almost no one knows what i'm doing with a fisheye and a funny tripod head anyway, but they're definitely not laughing! I guess you never shoot with a string tied from the camera to your shoe, because people might (gasp) think you're funny, and laugh!
Anyway, don't want to start a flame war, I respect your advice on this forum, smooth, I hope you can do the same, so let's stop this silly argument. I'll post a couple panoramas from each lens when I finish this great beer
-jeff
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Smooth
Posts: 3773
Location: Mount Panorama, Australia
Registered: 21 Jul 2004
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Re: Camera Upgrade
Posted: 25 Aug 2005 at 15:58 GMT
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Andrey,
Mate, they are just my opinions.
Advise was asked for, I gave it. So now how you. People have their own brains and it is their money. It is for them to make the decision.
As for lens flare only to the outer edge. Hmm, not in the shots I've seen! None the less it is good you stick up for your home grown product.
Shooting with a full circular lens is bound to be different to full frame. Shooting 6+TB shots with a Peleng or Sigma defeats the point. This set up is good because it can be done in 4 shots (even 3) Sure if you want the overlap this will help with trimming edge chromatic aberration and vignetting. But really if you are going to shoot this way (taking 6 to 8 shots) then buy the 10.5mm or 15mm fisheye in the first place and get it right from the start.
Secondhand? Yeah, good point!
Not a debate, just opinions.
All the best, Smooth
www.smooth360.com
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